It's of no use to continue asking questions, they will not be answered anyway. You will be ignored. The boinc_admin googlegroup listing is for the discussion of everything BOINC, not for PMC discussions, BOINC changes or god forbid, asking questions and expecting answers.

Nothing has changed, nothing will change. Shrug.

Reference: A. https://docs.google.com/document/d/1C6pU5RqidYBxk9oyAevm1yH1tn4Hw27oM8YpvsnR-gg/edit

I agree 100% with that statement Jord.

Your voice have been supported by well respected contributers to the project who stated that it is a waste of time asking questions here, the management will never care to visit it let alone reply to a question.

I have appointed myself as a BOINC Critique for I am not getting the answers that I am seeking and hope to get Community involvment with the aim to improve the image of this Software. This is not easy as we do not have a "General" area in which we as users can discuss BOINC in General. To date we as users have been disregarded. I am not interested in the 97% who do not reply or appear to care for they will have a chance to say something if the venue for discussion is provided. As it is we as "Users" have no usefull venue in which we can discuss anything relating to BOINC for the Forum does not offer such choice where to do so, neither have we an area for "Support". Both of those were promissed to us in reference: A. The BOINC Project Governance that we all supposed to follow was written nearly 3 months ago. I respect that you are all going through a difficult time not being paid and all but we as users have been doing this as Volunteers for years at free time. Currently:

We do not have an effective forum in which we can discuss BOINC in General. The Administrator of the Forum have no power to change the Layout and include an area for "General" Discussion or an area for "Support". It needs to be referred to David Anderson for approval as stated by the Admin of this forum. David in Reference A states that he has no more authority than any other member of the PMC and has indicated that he is busy with other projects. Why are users asked to email David? Should this not be the done by the Project Administrator of the Forum? as is stated by Reference A without being referred to the Chairman and why is it the responsibility to email David direct should a user wishes to have an Area for Discussion..

I am aware that I am again too long in my explanation but all I wish to say to conclude that this is the time for all of us to stand up what we want from this software for to date users were not considered to be necessary. Yet without users you be wasting your time. Please voice your oppinion in the right forum or list, wherever it might be for I can not find the support forum where I might ask a question from the management. If I ask it somewhere else, it will not be answered because as one PMC members stated he will not answer a day to day management question.

Lastly, can somebody tell me where is the PMC list that is open to the public for I can't find it. Does anybody know when will the Governance Document in Reference A will take effect? I ask this because nothing has changed in three months, progress have not been promulgated to the public and questions remains unanswered. I was under the impression that community involvement and consensus included the users and the public. Where is Opennes and Transparency.

I am aware that I am again too long in my explanation but all I wish to say to conclude that this is the time for all of us to stand up what we want from this software for to date users were not considered to be necessary. Yet without users you be wasting your time. Please voice your oppinion in the right forum or list, wherever it might be for I can not find the support forum where I might ask a question from the management. If I ask it somewhere else, it will not be answered because as one PMC members stated he will not answer a day to day management question.

As a general rule, you get what you are willing to pay for in this world. BOINC has been paid for by others for a long time, and now they are dropping their support, at least for the time being. Are you willing to take over the support? Otherwise, just asking for what you want is not very useful.

To date we as users have been disregarded. I am not interested in the 97% who do not reply or appear to care for they will have a chance to say something if the venue for discussion is provided. As it is we as "Users" have no usefull venue in which we can discuss anything relating to BOINC for the Forum does not offer such choice where to do so, neither have we an area for "Support".

..

We do not have an effective forum in which we can discuss BOINC in General. The Administrator of the Forum have no power to change the Layout and include an area for "General" Discussion or an area for "Support".

Make a thread in any forum and I'll sticky it. Then you point everyone you want to have a discussion in it to that thread. As simple as pie.
You still haven't said what you think needs changed, other than the contents of the PMC and these forums. No, sorry, there are no forums for that.

But do know this: we're a technical forum where users - be it people who run the BOINC client, or project administrators who run the back-end - who have problems with their BOINC can ask for help from other users. It does happen that a BOINC developer peeks in on his own and answers, or that they do so after someone on the forums asked them to come take a look.
We are not a general discussion forum about anything BOINC. It is surely possible that you can have such a discussion on these boards, but we're not specifically made for them. In this case, as you have done with your cross-posting thread, post it in the Q&P forum. Technically correct, as you have questions about the PMC and problems with their setup.

In my opinion there is really no need for a new forum, which I will state as well when officially asked upon.

It needs to be referred to David Anderson for approval as stated by the Admin of this forum.

Yes, because David Anderson is a Volunteer moderator, Project administrator, Project developer.

David in Reference A states that he has no more authority than any other member of the PMC and has indicated that he is busy with other projects. Why are users asked to email David? Should this not be the done by the Project Administrator of the Forum? as is stated by Reference A without being referred to the Chairman and why is it the responsibility to email David direct should a user wishes to have an Area for Discussion..

You are deliberately(?) making things more confusing than they really need to be. As I have explained in your other thread, I have the administrator title to do away with spammers and the crap they leave behind. If you want something changed on a project's forums, you go to the owner of the project's server & forums. In this case that is David. It is that simple. There is no need to ask the PMC for any of that, as it is not one of their roles.

David has the power to change things on the forums. That's because he can log in on Isaac, the BOINC domain server. He can add to the BOINC back-end software running on that server, the one that runs this forum, the one that runs the Alpha project, the whole BOINC web site, the Wiki's, etc.

No need to make things more than they really are, I have never made more of the administrative title that I have as it is: a means to delete posts left behind by spammers. That you or someone else feels it must be more, it needs to be more, is something you have to live with. Because of the way that the BOINC forum software is constructed, this could not be added to my moderator account, without a structural rewrite of the software and database. It was easier to give me administrative powers.

These do not come with a login on the server, or an option to read contents of the hard drive of Isaac, and write edited contents back.
Editing the forums also require that the person on the other side is fluent in writing HTML, PHP, C, CPP and some other languages, which I am not. I do not need a login on Isaac. I don't yearn for it. I am very glad I do not have it.

Lastly, can somebody tell me where is the PMC list that is open to the public for I can't find it.

As I told you in your other thread, until otherwise dictated you can use the BOINC Development email list. This list does need registration to be able to post to it and receive answers. Its archives are freely available. It's for: 'News and discussion for people developing, porting or debugging BOINC software', so it's as good a place for now as anything else. It's also the place that you're guaranteed that all the PMC members are registered to, something that cannot be said of the boin_admin google group. It is still not a place that guarantees that you get an answer from anyone, especially not if you continue posting in the heated way you've done so far.

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