I installed the 6.2.14 Client on 1 of my Ubuntu Box's and noticed a 4000+ drop in the Measured integer speed Score, the Measured floating point speed seemed to stay about the same though.

I did do a manual install to a /home/xxxxxxx/BOINC Directory, I did it that way so I would have more Ownership & Permissions with it installed there, so Boinc isn't installed where it would normally be by going through the Synaptic Package Manager.

Once it was installed there I completely Un-Installed the original 5.10.45 Client I was running.

I did 2 other Box's only using the 5.10.45 Client, I did a manual install on them to a /home/xxxxxxx/BOINC Directory too & they showed the same 4000+ drop in the Measured integer speed Score, the Measured floating point speed seemed to stay about the same on them too though.

As far as I can tell all 3 Box's still run the Wu's just as fast as they did before changing Directories on them & so why the 4000+ drop in Integer Score ... ???

There is a 32 bit and a 64 bit client available which could explain this.

That would be the first thing to check (whether the client is 32 bit or 64). I'm sure it came from a package whose name indicates it's the 64 bit package but ocassionally the wrong file gets put in the package. I'm almost certain there is a command that checks if an executable is 32 bit or 64 bit but I can't remember the name of that command.

Another possible explanation is that the client in the Berkeley installer is not the same client as in the apt package. Maybe the apt package maintainer(s) altered the Berkeley version slightly to make it more suitable for Ubuntu and maybe that mod affects the benchmarks. However, PoorBoy, if you simply copied the executables from the directory the apt package created into /home/xxxxxx/BOINC then they must be the same client (unless the copy command somehow altered it which is not likely).

I can't see how running the same executable from a different directory could cause the benchmarks to differ.

I didn't copy the boinc client executable from the old directory, that I Downloaded & used to install the Client with but it's something to try I guess. Later I'll re-install the Boinc Client in it's original Directory and try & copy the Executables if it will let me after I ask for Ownership of the Folder.

I'll have to hunt them down because the Synaptic Package Manager puts the BOINC Files in at least 2 places possibly 3. I didn't think I installed the wrong Client either but checked all 3 Box's & all 3 say the same thing > Mon 04 Aug 2008 08:36:11 AM EDT||Starting BOINC client version 6.2.14 for x86_64-pc-linux-gnu < as far as I know thats the 64-Bit Client which is what I would want since my Box's run 64-Bit OS's ... :)

All I can try is the 5.10.45 from the original directory after I reinstall it there again because the 6.2.14 is new & I didn't have it installed in the first place.

I reinstalled the Boinc Client 5.10.45 thru the Synaptic Package Manager & ran a Benchmark on it, the Measured Integer Speed Score was back where it was before. So then I copied the Executables to the /home/xxxxxxx/BOINC Folder, started up Boinc & ran the Benchmarks again, same as before, 4000+ Lower Integer speed Score than what I get from the Boinc Client Installed in the original Installation Folder.

I wish I had the Option of Installing the Boinc Client thru the Synaptic Package Manager where I wanted to like the Windows Boinc Installer allows you to do but I don't so trying that is out ...

He's back on 5.10.45 (64bit), where 6.2.14(32 or 64 bit?) gave the lower integer.

??? ... Forget about your 32-Bit hangup Sekerob, I haven't run a 32-Bit Client or OS in ages on any of my Box's so anything I say about a Client or OS it's about a 64-Bit Client or OS, I checked & Doubled Checked and I'm running a 64-Bit Client & OS on all 3 Box's I've mentioned in my Posts so lets put the 32-Bit thoughts under the Rug ... :)

Soooooooo basically what I'm talking about is:

1 Box with the 64-Bit Client v6.2.14 that isn't "back" on anything & running a Linux Ubuntu v8.04 OS that shows a 4000+ lower Integrer Speed when the Boinc Client isn't installed in the normal places the Synaptic Package Manager would install it in but with all the Boinc Files in 1 place that's located in a /home/xxxxxxx/BOINC Directory where I have more Permissions to the Files.

And 2 different Box's with a 64-Bit Client v5.10.45 that aren't "back" on anything either & both running a Linux Ubuntu v8.04 OS & both of them show a 4000+ lower Integrer Speed too when the Boinc Client isn't installed in the normal places the Synaptic Package Manager would install it in but with all the Boinc Files in 1 place that's located in a /home/xxxxxxx/BOINC Directory where I have more Permissions to the Files.

I'm still trying to remember the name of the command that checks if it's 32 bit or 64. Or maybe there is no such command.

Maybe you're thinking of file?

chriss@plasma:~$ file /usr/bin/boinc_client
/usr/bin/boinc_client: ELF 64-bit LSB executable, x86-64, version 1 (SYSV), for GNU/Linux 2.6.8, dynamically linked (uses shared libs), stripped

1 Box with the 64-Bit Client v6.2.14 that isn't "back" on anything & running a Linux Ubuntu v8.04 OS that shows a 4000+ lower Integrer Speed when the Boinc Client isn't installed in the normal places the Synaptic Package Manager would install it in but with all the Boinc Files in 1 place that's located in a /home/xxxxxxx/BOINC Directory where I have more Permissions to the Files.

Weird.
Is everything's installed on the same physical disk in the box? i.e. / and /home are on the same disk.

Weird.
When installing from the repositories, ubuntu will create a user for you (imaginatively named boinc) and all your standard boinc stuff (/var/lib/boinc-client /etc/boinc-client) is then given permissions and ownership of that user. But the binaries are installed and owned by root. Perhaps this gives the core client binary 'better/more/faster' access to whatever it's using to calculate the benchmarks?

Since you sound like you're in an experimental mood, what happens if you give the client binary (in your home dir) root ownership (1) and then run the benchmarks?

(1)
cd /home/xxxxxxx/BOINC
sudo chown root:root ./boinc

(substitute ./boinc for the name of the client if it's different)

[edit]
Are you certain that the client is not already running (from its default location) when you benchmark the client in your home dir? Check your CPU usage through system monitor. Maybe the second is competing with the first for resources...

Warrants further investigation, but real life just intervened.
[/edit]

I'm still trying to remember the name of the command that checks if it's 32 bit or 64. Or maybe there is no such command.

Maybe you're thinking of file?

chriss@plasma:~$ file /usr/bin/boinc_client
/usr/bin/boinc_client: ELF 64-bit LSB executable, x86-64, version 1 (SYSV), for GNU/Linux 2.6.8, dynamically linked (uses shared libs), stripped

I can't check that file because I don't have it, it may be there for the normal installation through the Synaptic Manager, but installing it the way I am all the BOINC Files are located in 1 Central Directory Folder only instead of being scattered all over the place & doing a seach brings up nothing on a boinc_client file ... :)

Weird.
Is everything's installed on the same physical disk in the box? i.e. / and /home are on the same disk

Chris, as far as I know everythings on the same disk, in fact 1 of the Box's only has 1 disk in it, as far as being on the same Partion that I can't verify but it should all be on the same Partition to since Ubuntu only uses 1 Partition & a small linux-swap file area on the disk.

Weird.
When installing from the repositories, ubuntu will create a user for you (imaginatively named boinc) and all your standard boinc stuff (/var/lib/boinc-client /etc/boinc-client) is then given permissions and ownership of that user. But the binaries are installed and owned by root. Perhaps this gives the core client binary 'better/more/faster' access to whatever it's using to calculate the benchmarks?

Since you sound like you're in an experimental mood, what happens if you give the client binary (in your home dir) root ownership (1) and then run the benchmarks?

(1)
cd /home/xxxxxxx/BOINC
sudo chown root:root ./boinc

(substitute ./boinc for the name of the client if it's different)

Same thing Chris, the Benchmarks are 4000+ Points Lower than what they were, I even checked the boinc file & it showed root as being the owner before I ran the BMarks again ...

Are you certain that the client is not already running (from its default location) when you benchmark the client in your home dir? Check your CPU usage through system monitor. Maybe the second is competing with the first for resources...

No, thats not happening, I've checked that many times already, if I stop the client nothing else is running until I start the client back up again. That plus I've Un-Installed the original Boinc Files & Folders & Directories completly that the Synaptic Package Manager installed using the Synaptic Manager to do it.

Then I ran a file seach for Boinc & the only ones showing up are the ones I installed in the /home/xxxxxxx/BOINC Directory, so theres no way I would think for the Original Installation to be running ... :)

PS: As I said previously Boinc isn't running any slower with the Files installed in the /home/xxxxxxx/BOINC Folder than what it was running with the Files installed wherever the Synaptic Package Manager installs them.

I've verified that with the Wu's running the same times with either Installation Method. It just Benchmarks the Integer Speed way lower doing it my way is the only change I see it the 2 Methods.

Thats no big deal really as long as your running Projects with Fixed Benchmarks which seems is going to be the norm eventually but if you run a Project using your Benchmarks then 4000+ Points in the Integer Speed will be a serious drop in Credit from where it should be ... 0_0

At this point, I'd be inclined to blame 6.2.14 or something related to it.

I have a slightly older version which I tested against. 5.10.8 for x86_64-pc-linux-gnu. Sorry, don't have an 8.04 at hand.

I benchmarked it. Results:
2008-08-05 13:08:33 [---] Running CPU benchmarks
2008-08-05 13:09:05 [---] Benchmark results:
2008-08-05 13:09:05 [---] Number of CPUs: 2
2008-08-05 13:09:05 [---] 1652 floating point MIPS (Whetstone) per CPU
2008-08-05 13:09:05 [---] 7603 integer MIPS (Dhrystone) per CPU

I installed v6.2.14 in my home dir and copied all the 5.10.8 files except the binaries. It benchmarked as follows:
05-Aug-2008 13:31:06 [---] Running CPU benchmarks
05-Aug-2008 13:31:37 [---] Benchmark results:
05-Aug-2008 13:31:37 [---] Number of CPUs: 2
05-Aug-2008 13:31:37 [---] 1801 floating point MIPS (Whetstone) per CPU
05-Aug-2008 13:31:37 [---] 5051 integer MIPS (Dhrystone) per CPU

(A ~2500 drop)

I copied the binaries from 5.10.8 to my home dir and benchmarked that:
2008-08-05 13:37:56 [---] Running CPU benchmarks
2008-08-05 13:38:27 [---] Benchmark results:
2008-08-05 13:38:27 [---] Number of CPUs: 2
2008-08-05 13:38:27 [---] 1651 floating point MIPS (Whetstone) per CPU
2008-08-05 13:38:27 [---] 7590 integer MIPS (Dhrystone) per CPU

Can see similarity in lower benchmarks with 6.2.14, but can't explain why PB's action of using older binaries in /home produces the same drop.

(Admittedly, this isn't 5.10.45 which may have some significance, but I doubt it . :)

Here's a thought: Does CPU throttling have something to do with it? I don't think I've ever entered any CPU throttling options and I can't say if those settings have any effect at benchmark time.

[edit]
FWIW, this was all 64bit. Haven't done the tests with x86. Have to install an x86 linux somewhere first. Not today though.
[/edit]

Chris, as far as I know everythings on the same disk, in fact 1 of the Box's only has 1 disk in it, as far as being on the same Partion that I can't verify but it should all be on the same Partition to since Ubuntu only uses 1 Partition & a small linux-swap file area on the disk.

Thought so. Just checking something obvious. :)

Same thing Chris, the Benchmarks are 4000+ Points Lower than what they were, I even checked the boinc file & it showed root as being the owner before I ran the BMarks again ...

That was a bit of a brain f##t on my part. Changing the ownership wouldn't have made a bit of difference. It's who you run it as that matters... ;)

No, thats not happening, I've checked that many times already, if I stop the client nothing else is running until I start the client back up again.

My tests correlate, so it's not this.

PS: As I said previously Boinc isn't running any slower with the Files installed in the /home/xxxxxxx/BOINC Folder than what it was running with the Files installed wherever the Synaptic Package Manager installs them.

Which is a good thing, as it means there's consistency in the science applications, just not in the CC.

Thats no big deal really as long as your running Projects with Fixed Benchmarks which seems is going to be the norm eventually but if you run a Project using your Benchmarks then 4000+ Points in the Integer Speed will be a serious drop in Credit from where it should be ... 0_0

Unfortunately, IMHO what's worse is that it may instil lack of faith of V6 client in the user base. Slower takeup. :(

I can't check that file because I don't have it, it may be there for the normal installation through the Synaptic Manager, but installing it the way I am all the BOINC Files are located in 1 Central Directory Folder only instead of being scattered all over the place & doing a seach brings up nothing on a boinc_client file ... :)

Yup, if you un-installed boinc-client via synaptic, you won't find it. :) But it's a useful utility as you can run it against pretty much any file using 'file filename' to see what magic hides within.

Okay Newbie talking here, what are you referring to when you say binaries & where are they so I can try Copying them to the /home `````` BOINC Directory. I'll have to Reinstall Boinc first though to do that.

They only time I ran across CPU Throttling with Linux was with my Quad Core Laptop, when I first installed Ubuntu on that it Benchmarked way lower too & the Wu's ran slower. So I did a little investigating & found out Linux likes to install something on Laptops that throttles the CPU.

So I used the CPU Frequency Scaler you can add to the Top Panel in Ubuntu & sure enough the CPU was only running about 2/3's of what it should have been running even when running BOINC.

I Uninstalled the Throttler (Can't remember the name of it now) & the CPU jumped back up to where it should run & stock speed & has been fine since.

As far as my Desktop Box's go I highly doubt that their being Throttled in any way as they usually run at the top of the Top Host Lists at any Project I run.

All my Box's are 64-Bit too Chris so we're on the same Page with that ... :)

@Poorboy:

Could you confirm just once more that the boinc in both directories are exactly the same file? Please run the cmp command on both files. Cmp does a bytewise comparison of 2 files. If the 2 differ cmp will say so. If they are the same cmp says nothing.

cmp /usr/bin/boinc_client /home/xxxxxx/BOINC/boinc

I reinstalled Boinc Client 5.10.45 1 Box & this is what I got when comparing the 2 files you asked me to Compare.

poorboy@PBOYZTOY14L:~$ cmp /usr/bin/boinc_client /home/poorboy/BOINC/boinc
/usr/bin/boinc_client /home/poorboy/BOINC/boinc differ: byte 25, line 1

I really feel you're comparing 2 slightly different boinc executables and just don't realise it. Or else they're calling 2 different libraries or something.

Okay Newbie talking here, what are you referring to when you say binaries & where are they so I can try Copying them to the /home `````` BOINC Directory. I'll have to Reinstall Boinc first though to do that.

Binaries is Linux speak for executables. The BOINC binaries are: boinc (or boinc_client), boincmgr and boinc_cmd.

Thats what I figured & all ready tried that a few times & it didn't make difference ...

I just checked the 32 bit machine (Fedora 8) with 6.2.15

Binaries in ~/Desktop/BOINC (totally clean install from the .sh) I get 1399/2950

Binaries in /usr/local/bin (picked up on my old install) I get 1302/3004


Both are running as unprivileged users. kathryn in the first case and boinc in the second case.

Ownership of the files would be kathryn in the first case and root in the second case.


I'm too exhausted to see what happens on my 64 bit machine. I'll try tomorrow night, but I think I need to fight with my router tomorrow.

---

Kathryn :o)

I finally did get the Proper Benchmarks from 1 Box with the Client v5.10.45 installed to a /home/xxxxxxx/BOINC Directory following the below Procedure. I can't do it for the Box with the Client v6.2.14 installed in a /home/xxxxxxx/BOINC Directory because I don't have the proper Binaries to copy from yet.

I suspect who ever sends out the Linux repositorie files tweaks the boinc binaries a little before sending them out to make them give a higher Benchmark than what Boinc sends out.

To get the proper Benchmarks from a /home/xxxxxxx/BOINC Directory do the following:

NOTE: This only works if your using the same Boinc Client Binaries in /home/xxxxxxx/BOINC Directory as you are copying from the /usr/bin Directory:

1. Do a install of the same Boinc Client you have already Installed in the /usr/bin Directory to the /home/xxxxxxx/BOINC Directory:

2. Copy the Boinc Binaries from the /usr/bin folder to the /home/xxxxxxx/BOINC Directory:

3. Take the boinc executable from the /home/xxxxxxx/BOINC Directory out of the Directory and Delete:
NOTE: The boinc_client you copied from the /usr/bin folder will replace the boinc executable your taking out of the /home/xxxxxxx/BOINC Directory.

4. This should allow you to use the boinc_client binarie you copied from the /usr/bin folder to start Boinc:

5. You can now Completely Un-Install the Synaptic Package Manager Boinc Installation & your Benchmarks will stay where they should be.

I finally did get the Proper Benchmarks from 1 Box with the Client v5.10.45 installed to a /home/xxxxxxx/BOINC Directory following the below Procedure.

Good job.

If I understand your procedure correctly and had to summarise it, I would have to say that the Berkeley client gives one benchmark value and the same version client provided by the repositories gives another (higher) benchmark value.

This would imply that the Ubuntu repository maintainer has possibly recompiled the boinc client, introducing further optimizations.

I actually reached this same conclusion earlier while trying to determine the difference between my results and yours. Whereas I replaced my binaries with the ubuntu ones, you likely replaced yours from a Berkeley download. My results went up, while yours stayed the same. An optimized client was the only answer I could fathom.

Should be pretty easy to test. Just have to download the stock client and check it.
[edit]
Sticking with my 5.10.8 client, it's pretty definitive.

5.10.8 - Ubuntu
2008-08-05 17:21:10 [---] Running CPU benchmarks
2008-08-05 17:21:42 [---] Benchmark results:
2008-08-05 17:21:42 [---] Number of CPUs: 2
2008-08-05 17:21:42 [---] 1644 floating point MIPS (Whetstone) per CPU
2008-08-05 17:21:42 [---] 7549 integer MIPS (Dhrystone) per CPU

5.10.8 - Berkeley
2008-08-05 17:23:28 [---] Running CPU benchmarks
2008-08-05 17:24:00 [---] Benchmark results:
2008-08-05 17:24:00 [---] Number of CPUs: 2
2008-08-05 17:24:00 [---] 1778 floating point MIPS (Whetstone) per CPU
2008-08-05 17:24:00 [---] 5120 integer MIPS (Dhrystone) per CPU

Got to admit, while I'm not surprised, I hadn't really noticed this difference. With the ease of use of aptitude, I can't remember the last time I downloaded a Berkeley client. Luckily I advise everyone to download from the repo's or I could have found myself in a bit of hot water about now. :)
[/edit]

So what does this mean for v6.2.14? Well, I guess it's either wait for the Ubuntu optimized one, or get stuck into the source and compiler optimizations. Or bribe someone to do it for you. :)

[edit]

I suspect who ever sends out the Linux repositorie files tweaks the boinc binaries a little before sending them out to make them give a higher Benchmark than what Boinc sends out.

Bingo. You added this while I was typing my reply. :)
[/edit]

Yeah, actually the only benefit of changing Directory's is everything is Centrally Located & you have more Ownership & Permission's than what you do with the Synaptic Package Manager Installation.

Other than that you'll still have to wait for the Optimized Binaries if in fact thay are from Linux or your Benchmarks will suffer. If Dr. Anderson has his way that won't matter eventually as the Credits will be Rubber Stamped from Berkeley to the Other Projects anyway.

Yeah, actually the only benefit of changing Directory's is everything is Centrally Located & you have more Ownership & Permission's than what you do with the Synaptic Package Manager Installation.

The permissions and ownerships created by the repository installers is not convenient but it does make the installation secure which is what you want if you have a multi-user system. And it guards against project apps doing things you don't want them to do. It hasn't happened yet but one day some scum bag in some backwater country that isn't interested in prosecuting his kind is going to create a project for the purpose of distributing a virus/malware/<nasty stuff>. BOINCers who are not running secure systems will get a rude awakening. Those who are secure will try not to laugh too hard but I'm sure there will be more than a few "I told ya so" messages in the forums.

Actually I'm the only one who has ever messed with any of my Box's, my wife doesn't even know how to use a Mouse. I tried to teach her one time but she got so frustrated she just walked away & has never tried to use a Computer again. All my Box's are Located @ home too & in an out of the way spot, so it's not like somebody's going to just come walking in and start playing with them,

Anyway about Security, what if once everything was Manually Installed & running properly in the /home/xxxxxxx/BOINC Directory I changed the Ownership back to root, would that make the Installation any more Secure or not. I can't see how it would hurt anything & I can always give myself Ownership again if I need to mess with the Files ... ???

Actually I'm the only one who has ever messed with any of my Box's, my wife doesn't even know how to use a Mouse. I tried to teach her one time but she got so frustrated she just walked away & has never tried to use a Computer again. All my Box's are Located @ home too & in an out of the way spot, so it's not like somebody's going to just come walking in and start playing with them,

Anyway about Security, what if once everything was Manually Installed & running properly in the /home/xxxxxxx/BOINC Directory I changed the Ownership back to root, would that make the Installation any more Secure or not. I can't see how it would hurt anything & I can always give myself Ownership again if I need to mess with the Files ... ???

The security problem is not with persons from your site (home) but with intruders from outside (viruses, worms, etc.). When the affected service (not necessarily BOINC) has root privileges, the problem can get much worse than with user privileges.

Gruß,
Gundolf

---

Computer sind nicht alles im Leben. (Kleiner Scherz)

Well I guess I don't worry about intruders to much, for 1 thing theres nothing on my computer that they could use against me to do me any harm. I simply don't trust Computers enough to be putting anything important on them.

The worst thing that could happen is that they put a Virus on 1 of them but since their not connected the virus would be contained th that Computer & so maybe I'd have to spend a few hours Formating the Drive and putting a OS back on it.

Other than that I don't see what damage they would do, it's not like their going to start World War 3 from my Computer ... hahaha