What happened to Menubar for Mac?

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Odysseus

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Message 4205 - Posted: 5 May 2006, 23:53:30 UTC

I notice that Menubar v5.2.13 is no longer listed on the download page. Has it been disparaged? Are there any plans to update it to v5.4.x, whatever the next official client release will be?

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Profile Jord
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Message 4211 - Posted: 6 May 2006, 20:35:32 UTC
Last modified: 7 May 2006, 0:33:04 UTC

OK, I asked Charlie Fenton about this, here's his answer just in:

I was curious whether anyone would notice. ;=) Martin Patfield
originally wrote it because there was no GUI available for the
Macintosh, before I ported the BOINC Manager to the Mac. Martin
ceased supporting it last November due to other commitments.

I updated it a couple of times after that by patching in later
versions of the BOINC Client.

But it doesn't support newer features such as account managers and
attaching to projects with a password rather than an account key.
Also, it does not run natively on Intel Macs. We don't have anyone
with the time to upgrade it.

So we have decided to discontinue offering it because it has become
so out of date and because the BOINC Manager provides the
functionality.

Cheers,
--Charlie

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mmciastro
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Message 4222 - Posted: 7 May 2006, 0:19:55 UTC
Last modified: 7 May 2006, 0:44:06 UTC

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Profile Jord
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Message 4223 - Posted: 7 May 2006, 0:34:04 UTC - in response to Message 4222.  

I don't know Charlie "W"eston, I do know Charlie Fenton.

:)

What you talking about, huh? ;)

Sorry... I was in a hurry earlier. And damn, I had the email open... But I just couldn't type the name, apparently. Fixed now. Thanks Tony. :)
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mmciastro
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Message 4225 - Posted: 7 May 2006, 0:43:49 UTC - in response to Message 4222.  

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Odysseus

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Message 4226 - Posted: 7 May 2006, 9:10:58 UTC - in response to Message 4211.  

... it doesn't support newer features such as account managers and
attaching to projects with a password rather than an account key.
Also, it does not run natively on Intel Macs. We don't have anyone
with the time to upgrade it.

So we have decided to discontinue offering it because it has become
so out of date and because the BOINC Manager provides the
functionality.


Thanks for the reply. I'm very disappointed to hear that you don't consider PPC Macs worth supporting any more, especially considering that all of the Intel Macs available so far are laptops and 'consumer' systems with severely limited potential for expansion. If I could afford a new system it would definitely be a G5--and even when the mini-towers come out with Intel CPUs, it's not as if all the IBM and Motorola CPUs will suddenly vanish ... But I guess it's hard to justify devoting more than 4% of your programming resources to support that small proportion of BOINC hosts, the same situation that prevented three-quarters of the systems I had running SETI Classic from making the transition to BOINC in the first place.

JFTR I haven't noticed any missing features that matter to me, and none of the projects I'm running needed anything more than an account key to get started with; on the contrary, I certainly would miss the ability to see what BOINC is doing at a glance without having to open a window for a full-blown separate program. (I admit I haven't tried BOINC Manager on a Mac, but there are several aspects of the Windows version I dislike or find pointless.) So I'll keep running Menubar on the G4s until it stops working altogether ... Any idea when that will be? When BOINC v5.4.x becomes official? Or will it be allowed to linger on, like the v4.x clients now making incorrect credit claims for their SETI Enhanced work?

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Profile Jord
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Message 4231 - Posted: 7 May 2006, 21:22:30 UTC
Last modified: 7 May 2006, 21:23:30 UTC

More from Charlie:

BOINC Menubar is a separate program like BOINC Manager, though I will grant that it is much smaller.

BOINC Menubar has some other limitations in addition to the ones I
mentioned earlier. For example, it uses a very primitive method for
communicating with the BOINC client. Every time you issue many of
its commands, it kills the BOINC client along with all project tasks
and restarts BOINC client with the new command. This means that any
work done since the last checkpoint is lost.

Unfortunately, we cannot please everybody; we try to make decisions
that will use our very limited resources to accomplish the most good
overall. Please remember that BOINC Menubar was never written or
maintained by those of us at U.C. Berkeley; it was a volunteer effort
by Martin Patfield of Greenkeeper software, We made it available on
our web site as a service, before BOINC Manager for the Mac was fully
developed. Martin has decided to pursue his education and no longer
has the time to volunteer,

Cheers,
--Charlie

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Odysseus

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Message 4333 - Posted: 14 May 2006, 8:10:18 UTC - in response to Message 4226.  
Last modified: 14 May 2006, 8:13:15 UTC

JFTR I haven't noticed any missing features that matter to me...

Well, I've just been smacked in the face with one; I wouldn't fault anyone for thinking it looks like egg ... :(

Running the Team MacNN SETI@home optimized v4.18 app, I've found that the current WU immediately errors out if I remove the app_info.xml file (so the system will download the Enhanced v5.x app). The recommended procedure is to first drain the cache by setting the project to No New Work ... but Menubar lacks this control. I tried inserting a <dont_request_more_work /> tag at the appropriate point in client_state.xml, but it doesn't stick. Am I missing a necessary step in such a 'hack', or is what I'm trying to do impossible without a BOINC Manager? Any way to send the command directly to the core client from the Terminal?
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Pepo
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Message 4337 - Posted: 14 May 2006, 21:33:49 UTC - in response to Message 4333.  
Last modified: 14 May 2006, 22:12:07 UTC

Any way to send the command directly to the core client from the Terminal?

You can telnet to the host on port e.g. 31416.

But the NNW command... I'll try to find out. Stay connected...

I've observed this sequence:
<boinc_gui_rpc_request>
 <project_nomorework>
  <project_url>http://einstein.phys.uwm.edu/</project_url>
 </project_nomorework>
</boinc_gui_rpc_request>

and project_allowmorework to turn it back. If your client uses authorization, it will fail :-( and request the authorization to be done first, probably not possible to do manually while typing in over telnet ;-)

Try to type it in on one line.

Peter
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Odysseus

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Message 4338 - Posted: 15 May 2006, 0:19:19 UTC - in response to Message 4337.  
Last modified: 15 May 2006, 0:20:59 UTC

Any way to send the command directly to the core client from the Terminal?

You can telnet to the host on port e.g. 31416.

But the NNW command...

Thanks a lot! I may not have to resort to this, as I've been directed to the "fanout" download directory, where I can get an Enhanced app, which I hope to install without disturbing the Team MacNN worker, hence obviating the need to drain my cache. If that doesn't work, though, I'll give your suggestion a try. I've never telnetted before, but I assume that
man telnet
will tell me what I need to know.
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Chris

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Message 5073 - Posted: 20 Jul 2006, 18:06:57 UTC

I was able to get a working build of BOINC Menubar on my MacBook. I downloaded the source code and complied it on XCode 2.3. I'm still alpha testing, but it appears to work as it should. I'm going to contact the BOINC team about my build and work on some improvements. I'll let y'all know if and when I've got a beta.
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celok

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Message 8153 - Posted: 11 Feb 2007, 12:44:53 UTC - in response to Message 5073.  

I'll let y'all know if and when I've got a beta.


Hi Chris,

is there any news about it?


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Nicolas

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Message 8159 - Posted: 11 Feb 2007, 16:39:10 UTC - in response to Message 4337.  

Any way to send the command directly to the core client from the Terminal?

You can telnet to the host on port e.g. 31416.

But the NNW command... I'll try to find out. Stay connected...

I've observed this sequence:
<boinc_gui_rpc_request>
 <project_nomorework>
  <project_url>http://einstein.phys.uwm.edu/</project_url>
 </project_nomorework>
</boinc_gui_rpc_request>

and project_allowmorework to turn it back. If your client uses authorization, it will fail :-( and request the authorization to be done first, probably not possible to do manually while typing in over telnet ;-)

Try to type it in on one line.

Peter

Telnet usually sends stuff one character at a time, and in the stupid way the core client manages those commands, the whole message has to be sent at once. Not even one line at a time.

And by the way, there is no boinccmd on Mac? That would be waaay easier.
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Pepo
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Message 8169 - Posted: 12 Feb 2007, 11:29:32 UTC - in response to Message 8159.  

And by the way, there is no boinccmd on Mac?

I don't know, I did not eat it ;-)

Peter

(Good question, I haven't got the idea it does not even exist. But I have not used it that time yet, so I have not mentioned it.) (sorry for the grammar in such past tenses, a bit hard for me)
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Angelo Mileto (c)

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Message 9144 - Posted: 27 Mar 2007, 10:38:18 UTC
Last modified: 27 Mar 2007, 10:50:33 UTC

I started a thread on the SETI board, but, was told it would be better here. So, here I am.

It took a bit of searching, but, I think I found the MenuBar source. I managed to get it downloaded (one file at a time) and opened in XCode. I've even managed to get all the file extensions fixed and get it to compile. But, it doesn't run.

Since I have no experience with XCode, I'm not sure what to look at for help. What I've been able to figure out so far from stepping through it is that it does not appear to load any of the preferences - not sure why as I don't know how to display the values of the variables. If I delete the BOINC Data folder, it does create a new one so that part works. But, if the folder is empty, I would think it should fall through to creating the basic preferences file - it does not.

If I put my current BOINC Data folder contents (I made a backup) in the new folder, it does successfully read the projects that I've signed up for so that part seems to be working.

If I look at my activity monitor, BOINC Menubar shows up as a process, but, there is no boinc as a process (which is there when the current working version is running).

I have a screen shot of the debug window, but, don't know how to upload it here, so, if anyone could help, let me know and I could (I guess) e-mail it or if there is another forum/thread I should be discussing this, point me in that direction.

The other thing that I noticed if I examine the package contents of the current working version, the boinc file in the resources folder is an Unix executable. In my compiled app, it is a plain document. Not sure if that's any indication of what the problem is or not, but, thought I'd throw it out there.

I guess the simple question would be how much desire there is for the Menubar version from the Mac community. I'm not sure where to go to find that answer. If any of you smart guys know, please let me know and I'll run it down.


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Profile Jord
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Message 9145 - Posted: 27 Mar 2007, 13:33:29 UTC
Last modified: 27 Mar 2007, 13:33:42 UTC

Hi Angelo, I sent an email to Charlie Fenton about this. He's the main BOINC developer for the Mac. He'll probably pass by at a later date to give some pointers.

As for if people still want the menubar or not, you may best ask on other (project) forums.
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Charlie Fenton
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Message 9159 - Posted: 27 Mar 2007, 23:17:00 UTC - in response to Message 8159.  
Last modified: 27 Mar 2007, 23:39:00 UTC

And by the way, there is no boinccmd on Mac? That would be waaay easier.

boinc-cmd is available for every release of BOINC for the Mac. It is packaged with the command-line core client.

To download boinc-cmd for the Mac, from the general download page click on the "All versions" link. Then download the "Unix command-line version." You will find boinc_cmd inside the move_to_boinc_dir folder. After you copy it into your BOINC Data folder, either run the included Mac_SA_Secure.sh script or run the BOINC Manager installer again to set up correct file permissions.

Even though boinc_cmd is packaged with the stand-alone client, it is completely compatible with the GUI version. Directions for using boinc_cmd can be found at http://boinc.berkeley.edu/boinc_cmd.php
Charlie Fenton
BOINC / SETI@home Macintosh & Windows Programmer
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Charlie Fenton
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Message 9160 - Posted: 27 Mar 2007, 23:48:45 UTC - in response to Message 9144.  
Last modified: 27 Mar 2007, 23:53:21 UTC

It took a bit of searching, but, I think I found the MenuBar source. I managed to get it downloaded (one file at a time) and opened in XCode. I've even managed to get all the file extensions fixed and get it to compile. But, it doesn't run.

[ snip ]

I guess the simple question would be how much desire there is for the Menubar version from the Mac community. I'm not sure where to go to find that answer. If any of you smart guys know, please let me know and I'll run it down.


There have been huge changes to the BOINC client since BOINC MenuBar was deprecated. I seriously doubt the last version of Menubar would work with the current BOINC client without major revision, though I honestly don't know. In any case, BOINC MenuBar had far less functionality than the current BOINC Manager or the current boinc_cmd command-line tool.

As far as I know, there have been very few requests to reinstate support for it, and I suspect that getting it working with a usefully comprehensive feature set would be a sizeable undertaking.
Charlie Fenton
BOINC / SETI@home Macintosh & Windows Programmer
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Charlie Fenton
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Message 9161 - Posted: 28 Mar 2007, 0:21:02 UTC - in response to Message 9159.  
Last modified: 28 Mar 2007, 0:21:13 UTC

You will find boinc_cmd inside the move_to_boinc_dir folder.

If you installed the BOINC Manager and are running the BOINC Client which is embedded in the Manager, copy only boinc_cmd into your BOINC Data folder; you won't need any of the other files included in this package.
Charlie Fenton
BOINC / SETI@home Macintosh & Windows Programmer
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Angelo Mileto (c)

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Message 9179 - Posted: 28 Mar 2007, 22:29:55 UTC

Ageless, thanks for forwarding the e-mail!!!!

Charlie, Thanks for chiming in! I really appreciate it. Part of the reason I'm still running the menubar is a result of a lot of the threads I had read with people having minor to serious problems with the "full" Mac client.

I also understand the amount of changes that may or may not be required, which, is partly why I was asking. So I guess convince me as to why I should use the full version? I don't really care too much about the graphics as I've not missed having the old SETI screen saver for a long time. My screen is quite happy being blank :) :)

One of the real advantages that I think was in the MenuBar client that I think is gone was the icon on the menu bar showing what it was currently working on and the progress. Is there any possibility of incorporating that small code snippet into the new clients?

I do understand the "simple view" vs the "advanced view" and my comment as for the size may be inaccurate as I haven't loaded the new client. But, I do know the MenuBar one was quite small.

Again, thanks so much for taking the time to discuss something that I'm sure you have discussed more than a few times.

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Message boards : BOINC Manager : What happened to Menubar for Mac?

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