Need help putting together a Computer for boinc

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chimmey17

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Message 103148 - Posted: 23 Feb 2021, 18:04:02 UTC - in response to Message 103145.  
Last modified: 23 Feb 2021, 18:14:00 UTC

So what would be a more reasonable budget for what I am trying to do. second I going to say that servers would just be a way too far out of my budget is this correct? If so how much more would I have to increase it to make it possible
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Peter Hucker
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Message 103151 - Posted: 23 Feb 2021, 18:40:01 UTC - in response to Message 103127.  

Another consideration given you are looking at "hiding" your computer in your bedroom - quite a lot of older servers are somewhat less than quite, and there is little choice of cooling fans :-
Depends how far you're willing to go. I changed the fan in a power supply from 40mm to 120mm to make it silent. This did involve a saw.
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robsmith
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Message 103152 - Posted: 23 Feb 2021, 18:40:35 UTC - in response to Message 103148.  

Servers are a grade one pain to get running properly, and in truth they are often nowhere near as fast as their much less expensive (money & time) than desktop computers. This is particularly true of second hand equipment which all too often use highly expensive, proprietary components like power supplies, cooling equipment, memory and so on. I think Peter in one of the early posts recounted his problems, and he is not alone in them.

Putting this in perspective:
To get a server to perform the same as my current desktop (8-core AMD FX plus 2 GTX1070ti GPUs) would probably cost the thick side of 3000, compared with about 1000 to build an equivalent new desktop. (in each case ignoring operating system costs, which depend on which way you want to go - Linux vs. Windows)

Since you already have a PC, what spec is it? The lowest cost way forward for you could well be spending a few hundred on a mid-range GPU and putting it in there, and that would probably have a very similar overall performance to my desktop!
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Message 103153 - Posted: 23 Feb 2021, 18:44:27 UTC - in response to Message 103151.  

You were lucky - one of my HP servers has a near silent PSU, but the howl from the cooling air around the CPUs is beyond belief. So it only gets powered up when I need some data off it.
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Peter Hucker
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Message 103154 - Posted: 23 Feb 2021, 18:44:43 UTC - in response to Message 103144.  

After thinking about it doing a server may not be the best idea. I would be doing a lot of projects that are GPU and I feel like it may be a pain to have to get them into the server but would it make sense to have a computer running maybe two GPUs are something and a server running powerful server CPUs or would I not see any bump form the server CPUs and am I justing reaching for something at this point?sorry if this are dumb questions there are just a lot of optinos and I bit over weldam. would you recommend asking on the forums for the certain projects that I want to run on what they have found is best.
I attached GPUs to my servers. They don't physically fit, but you can get "extension cords" designed for bitcoin mining which work perfectly. One end is a tiny 1 lane PCI express connector with a USB socket. The other end is what the graphics card connects to. You join the two together with a USB lead. My graphics cards sit on the bookshelf next to the server - which also means they have very good airflow. You can get 4-way versions too, so you can plug 4 cards into one socket. And I even tried daisychaining them, I can confirm it will take 16 of them. Unlike with gaming, you don't need the full bandwidth of the PCI Express socket - most of the time the graphics card is calculating on its own, very little data needs to pass to the motherboard.
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Peter Hucker
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Message 103155 - Posted: 23 Feb 2021, 18:46:49 UTC - in response to Message 103144.  

After thinking about it doing a server may not be the best idea. I would be doing a lot of projects that are GPU and I feel like it may be a pain to have to get them into the server but would it make sense to have a computer running maybe two GPUs are something and a server running powerful server CPUs or would I not see any bump form the server CPUs and am I justing reaching for something at this point?sorry if this are dumb questions there are just a lot of optinos and I bit over weldam. would you recommend asking on the forums for the certain projects that I want to run on what they have found is best.
I go by techpowerup's ratings. Look up a few cards you're thinking of and see how fast they are at doing FP32 and FP64 (single precision and double precision) calculations. Milkyway is double, Primegrid appears to be half of each, Einstein is single, Collatz is single, WCG (when they've finished the beta testing) is either double or some of each.
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Peter Hucker
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Message 103157 - Posted: 23 Feb 2021, 18:49:05 UTC - in response to Message 103145.  

Windows 10 (home will do, but pro is better)
(You can of course save a bit by going to Linux, but not every project supports that operating system, and it can be a bit of a problem getting GPUs to work properly even on projects that do support it.)
I wonder if that free Windows 10 upgrade is still possible? I've got seven here, most of them legitimate, sort of.
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Peter Hucker
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Message 103158 - Posted: 23 Feb 2021, 18:52:16 UTC - in response to Message 103153.  

You were lucky - one of my HP servers has a near silent PSU, but the howl from the cooling air around the CPUs is beyond belief. So it only gets powered up when I need some data off it.
With the lid off you can fit standard huge coolers with silent fans.

This reminds me of where I used to work, we had 7 servers in a rack, and I powered them up without warning the guy stood behind them. We'd just had a lot of building work done and the amount of dust collected in them was absurd. He approached me looking very angry and I almost couldn't recognise his face. It would appear all those servers do a dust clean or fan check at startup!
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Profile Keith Myers
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Message 103162 - Posted: 23 Feb 2021, 20:40:42 UTC

But often times there is no substitute for a server platform's ability to support dozens of cores and gpus. The reason I wanted to upgrade my TR host was to support the gain in cores that moving to an Epyc workstation motherboard and cpu provided and still be able to support the four gpus that host has always supported.

And the possibility of supporting as many as 7 gpus natively on the motherboard if I moved to single slot water cooling blocks.

Was a mostly painless move other than the initial issue of the cpu socket was not tightened up fully from manufacturing.
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robsmith
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Message 103163 - Posted: 23 Feb 2021, 21:20:35 UTC - in response to Message 103162.  

Ah, but how many years have you had working with computer, BONC, GPUs and what is your budget compared to that of the OP?
Without going into exact figures I would posit that the answer to each question is "A lot more".

It is all very well those of us with much more disposable cash saying "You need to spend $xxxxx", but if the OP has only $xxx it is an instant put-off.
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chimmey17

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Message 103168 - Posted: 24 Feb 2021, 0:04:32 UTC - in response to Message 103152.  

I have a ryzen 5 3600 with an rx5700xt
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chimmey17

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Message 103169 - Posted: 24 Feb 2021, 0:05:50 UTC - in response to Message 103163.  
Last modified: 24 Feb 2021, 0:17:06 UTC

Yeah I sure the at some point servers are going to be the right way to go I think that at my price range I would never really be able to put in say 3-4 gpus. With server hardware for cpu how does that compare to desktop cpus ? because I was thinking about a cpu only server and just uses my certain gpu but I feel like that may be way to much money what do you think?
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chimmey17

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Message 103170 - Posted: 24 Feb 2021, 0:08:38 UTC - in response to Message 103155.  
Last modified: 24 Feb 2021, 0:11:43 UTC

Ok when I get the time I really look at some cards check pricing and power and heat and noise and such and hopefully I will have a couple of good ones and with that maybe I could bring it here to see if anyone has done anything with those cards.second would this also be a good place to https://www.geeks3d.com/20140305/amd-radeon-and-nvidia-geforce-fp32-fp64-gflops-table-computing/
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Profile Keith Myers
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Message 103171 - Posted: 24 Feb 2021, 0:39:36 UTC - in response to Message 103163.  

Lots of years. But this was my first time with server hardware. The OP said he wanted to learn about server hardware. Was the same case with me. Totally familiar and comfortable with standard PC hardware . . . . . been doing that for over 20 years.

But server hardware was a completely new experience. Had to Google a lot, had to ask questions from other friends that had already gone this route.

No it wasn't a $500 upgrade, far from it. The cpu alone was $1100. I hadn't paid that much for a cpu since my first Intel Pentium on release day. The motherboard was very reasonable compared to what an updated Threadripper motherboard to handle Threadripper 3000 cpus would have cost, and very limited 4 gpu support choices. The TR3960 cpu I was thinking about would have cost $300 more than the equivalent Epyc 7402P cpu I ended up with. Same core count, just less maximum clocks. Still I can manage an all-core 3.35Ghz on that cpu.

I was able to reuse the same case, cooling solutions, power supply and gpus. Just had to purchase server memory. That was $300 for 64GB of 3200 RDIMM memory. So the entire upgrade cost $1100 for the cpu, $460 for the motherboard and $300 for the memory. Total $1860. That is a wee bit more than his $500 budget.

But old Intel server workstations can be bought for cheap on Ebay often with hard drives and Window OS installed at less than $300.
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Profile Keith Myers
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Message 103172 - Posted: 24 Feb 2021, 0:47:30 UTC
Last modified: 24 Feb 2021, 0:48:05 UTC

You can certainly just run with your existing hardware and add another gpu or upgraded gpu. But you are not going to find a reasonable cost on a used gpu in the current no stock anywhere environment.
Best you can hope for is someone to gift you an old gpu or for a token price or whatever.

What the server platform gains you is increased core counts, helpful for cpu focused projects and support for ECC memory and ability to handle many peripherals like many storage devices or PCIE add-in cards.
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chimmey17

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Message 103176 - Posted: 24 Feb 2021, 3:37:47 UTC - in response to Message 103171.  

So overall for my price range and understanding do you think I should go down the server route? If I where to go down that road how well would the 300 ish dollars or more servers run boinc and have you ever run those budget servers. Also thanks for the help
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chimmey17

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Message 103177 - Posted: 24 Feb 2021, 3:38:30 UTC - in response to Message 103114.  
Last modified: 24 Feb 2021, 3:56:46 UTC

I have gotten a lot of info thanks for all that already thank you all for that
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chimmey17

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Message 103186 - Posted: 24 Feb 2021, 14:58:48 UTC - in response to Message 103171.  

I also think it is important to understand that if I am able to get a good computer that will run boinc well for a couple of years to come I may be able to bump up my budget
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robsmith
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Message 103187 - Posted: 24 Feb 2021, 15:09:44 UTC - in response to Message 103186.  

A very wise way of progressing - no need to dump a large wad of cash on the counter only to find you don't enjoy doing what you bought the kit for.
Get something reasonable but expandable and work from there. Good luck and have fun.
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chimmey17

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Message 103192 - Posted: 24 Feb 2021, 17:40:27 UTC - in response to Message 103187.  

Yeah, I already run BOINC sometimes on my main pc but I really want a pc where I do not have to worry about it and it does not act as my main thing for everything so I think and will enjoy BOINC. I just really want to find the best CPU and GPU for me. Kinda wanted it handed to me because there are so many options that it is very hard to choose. But thanks for the luck hopefully using this place I will find what is best for me and I will start being able to help.
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Message boards : Questions and problems : Need help putting together a Computer for boinc

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