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Richard Haselgrove
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Message 108242 - Posted: 26 May 2022, 12:11:57 UTC - in response to Message 108238.  

I think I found the problem: "The spread of the virus, which originated in the UK, would have been slowed if BT Openworld had installed the latest Microsoft Outlook patches." - Microsoft software always does insane dangerous things. Should have used a proper email client.
That was exactly the point I was trying to make to them. I was working solo on a client's site, installing a new server or something, when the beastie dropped. I submitted it to Symantec for investigation from site, then packed up and drove home. No response from Symantec, so I rang BT support line. I was on the phone until well after midnight - we had to drop the call at midnight for a shift change, and they rang me back.

THEY were trying to help ME sort out my laptop: I was telling THEM that they had a serious problem at their end, and should be getting the night duty manager out of bed. I forget exactly how (it was 20 years ago, and we were both new to ADSL), but it was clear to me even that night that they were missing a critical service pack for Windows 2000.

I failed to get them to budge, which is why I went first to an alternative AV firm to confirm the payload was malicious, and then to the computer press.

End of conversation. I have the vineyards of the Douro to explore.
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Profile Dave
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Message 108243 - Posted: 26 May 2022, 12:58:05 UTC - in response to Message 108242.  

End of conversation. I have the vineyards of the Douro to explore.


Enjoy your exploration! I remember when still in the forces, returning with "slightly" over the limit of what I was allowed to bring back. Forces going through red channel is mandatory so I declared everything I had and was waved through. One of my colleagues in another Landrover thought he was smarter than the customs people and after being caught, poured away his excess in front of them, was still charged the duty on it and was delayed for several hours while they stripped his vehicle, to see if anything else was stashed there.
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Profile Gary Charpentier
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Message 108244 - Posted: 26 May 2022, 13:03:47 UTC - in response to Message 108239.  

Why would your email program run code from a header?
Because it is required by the standard. You haven't looked at the standards since the 1.0 versions have you? Delivery of advertising drives the standards now.
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Peter Hucker of the Scottish B...
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Message 108249 - Posted: 26 May 2022, 15:46:21 UTC - in response to Message 108243.  

Enjoy your exploration! I remember when still in the forces, returning with "slightly" over the limit of what I was allowed to bring back. Forces going through red channel is mandatory so I declared everything I had and was waved through. One of my colleagues in another Landrover thought he was smarter than the customs people and after being caught, poured away his excess in front of them, was still charged the duty on it and was delayed for several hours while they stripped his vehicle, to see if anything else was stashed there.
Surely being charged duty on what you no longer have is theft?
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Peter Hucker of the Scottish B...
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Message 108250 - Posted: 26 May 2022, 15:49:37 UTC - in response to Message 108244.  

Why would your email program run code from a header?
Because it is required by the standard. You haven't looked at the standards since the 1.0 versions have you? Delivery of advertising drives the standards now.
I very much doubt there's a standard requiring to run executable code in the headers. This is a set of headers from a random email message I recently received. Show me where code would reside:

Return-path: <*********@gmail.com>
Envelope-to: peter@hucker.plus.com
Delivery-date: Tue, 24 May 2022 23:18:01 +0100
Received: from [84.93.230.238] (helo=avasin-ptp-004.plus.net) by
 inmx-ptp-005.plus.net with esmtp (PlusNet MXCore v2.00) id 1ntcqn-0001BH-D2
 for peter@hucker.plus.com; Tue, 24 May 2022 23:18:01 +0100
Received: from mail-qk1-f180.google.com ([209.85.222.180]) by Plusnet
 Cloudmark Gateway with ESMTP id tcqbnYqC3RtOjtcqenZGMW; Tue, 24 May 2022
 23:17:52 +0100
X-CM-Score: 0.00
X-CNFS-Analysis: v=2.4 cv=NsbCzuRJ c=1 sm=1 tr=0 ts=628d5990 cx=a_idp_d a=FQwhE00XYU+i68H2eFB8gQ==:117 a=3WxFfEK7Oefi8ufxp4vznQ==:17 a=IkcTkHD0fZMA:10 a=oZkIemNP1mAA:10 a=x7bEGLp0ZPQA:10 a=GDeGtORxbDwA:10 a=yMhMjlubAAAA:8 a=SSmOFEACAAAA:8 a=EBOSESyhAAAA:8 a=pGLkceISAAAA:8 a=mbZ05ln8AAAA:8 a=jJrOw3FHAAAA:8 a=0benqdaLEbO3laoq09cA:9 a=W-hEp29Nl-O_6HoR:21 a=gKO2Hq4RSVkA:10 a=UiCQ7L4-1S4A:10 a=hTZeC7Yk6K0A:10 a=frz4AuCg-hUA:10 a=QEXdDO2ut3YA:10 a=yJM6EZoI5SlJf8ks9Ge_:22 a=lsIkP6lG2H4f0j7eDx0G:22
Received: by mail-qk1-f180.google.com with SMTP id p123so5973662qke.5 for
 <peter@hucker.plus.com>; Tue, 24 May 2022 15:17:52 -0700 (PDT)
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20210112; h=mime-version:date:from:subject:thread-topic:in-reply-to:message-id :references:to:content-transfer-encoding; bh=GNoYXBRofwwV7OTVgvTSJAIjSCVACf03g/Iu+u22AIU=; b=I4hTKBs6L9BRcWNmB84d4sZx7ad41gBtumvFBNDZbdLCUxbCVfmnkSvpECE6f1jemj e1KYGowNvJIs0qx+g0TQgXfNv7M2M+MsKRZ55+krOgzOzCsvcc5rejqoqQZ66UVjjp34 tu/rQlywCnF8zwKCU0ae1aGWay36S9eu2NbZeeSxdVUxO4qPD7tobiWnu30/1fRlb+jZ Fvs8ZsX8WcuBcKFKhuGmwvzVqAYF2BmC3zzmCCT2qWgMM/UBMvqiFqnRrSFgxpVxB+Su OejLPsTFNsLhgtxCwKqOHakLLSbPlOwaluSXBza50xTeCdWclT4RxMS0gWGdygxrBOgz WlIw==
X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20210112; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:date:from:subject:thread-topic :in-reply-to:message-id:references:to:content-transfer-encoding; bh=GNoYXBRofwwV7OTVgvTSJAIjSCVACf03g/Iu+u22AIU=; b=OszeU9NaL8GIuFbhmcNRgN6w/Svb2CVOvb0PUpgzNoQ1Q2RwxoIAZKKbMvYa58SAol +o/ueMzYFpt3toEVHhcSCAsOfZy2PYB42xINNcTcvlxj13P8iXqYpCuXNCYhkhXKlzUJ SIG8WPqDG9vkXahptog3YOWDCS3R82nxfQg06K63HuyDurrlNRRnQ0TKkU3N/bcoJoIP mik9sx8wva64YApcZAVJRPyw+paN5H6ZythBc5LzVMwlGcnNHRaXvzl8VqPerqI5Yrx4 ksVs7ILmZz9jaXR7A7Jyy/iIqqkkwgWhnDqoyMODF7a956BH1nvQuh6Fm90zR+63zGwD dqMg==
X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM5335uftjUpQFL8db/w5V9ds3T3Hbd71CfqS3ha81Gcn/9HAFF3od PnLNpQrnBINuOXD2NclXhPISrFl2lEo=
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Received: from FR1 ([70.40.98.117]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id
 n9-20020a05622a11c900b002f938f5bb78sm408286qtk.15.2022.05.24.15.17.48 for
 <peter@hucker.plus.com> (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-ECDSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256
 bits=128/128); Tue, 24 May 2022 15:17:48 -0700 (PDT)
MIME-Version: 1.0
Date: Tue, 24 May 2022 23:17:46 +0100
From: ******** <*********@gmail.com>
Thread-Topic: RE: *************
In-Reply-To: <op.1mn86el3mk2j66@ryzen.lan>
Message-ID: <2A1899D2-D256-45D7-B842-51C823ADB964@hxcore.ol>
References: <op.1mmj7e1mmk2j66@ryzen.lan>
 <BCD30274-86CC-4BAD-84B9-FD5CF1F19641@gmail.com> <op.1mn86el3mk2j66@ryzen.lan>
To: "Peter Hucker" <peter@hucker.plus.com>
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Content-Type: text/html; charset="utf-8"
X-CMAE-Envelope: MS4xfNAHcCLvTmPat+Pc91HWCG+Bh8JSAyK4RjRS1qIXoPHj8ZpA7Woo8+Av9IwpRt58OX5NyTcTneTUTgwjMPjSH4FY/fQ2CTmlKpmMPcNPg4aHA/s8Sb94 zRMQJK135n+ESKWRaizmk/xDe8hXlJNk0MJX5AeHJcBefdTxvPJszmQ5kufAjWu3nmwyfWdjEcIG88V9GlDuUiXQEbDktDOYqzs=
X-pn-pstn-db: " Spam 99
X-PN-Virus-Filtered: by PlusNet MXCore (v5.00)
X-PN-Spam-Filtered: by PlusNet MXCore (v5.00)
Subject: RE: 6
X-Antivirus: AVG (VPS 220524-4, 24/5/2022), Inbound message
X-Antivirus-Status: Clean
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Profile Dave
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Message 108251 - Posted: 26 May 2022, 16:18:25 UTC

Surely being charged duty on what you no longer have is theft?


He brought the spirits into the country therefore was liable to pay duty on them. The fact that they were in a puddle on the floor has no relevance.
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Peter Hucker of the Scottish B...
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Message 108252 - Posted: 26 May 2022, 16:27:31 UTC - in response to Message 108251.  
Last modified: 26 May 2022, 16:27:57 UTC

Surely being charged duty on what you no longer have is theft?
He brought the spirits into the country therefore was liable to pay duty on them. The fact that they were in a puddle on the floor has no relevance.
Lost goods, no tax. Imagine you bought a bottle of whisky in Asda and it fell on the floor at the checkout. Do the government still get money? Asda would refund you in full, so if the government still claimed the tax, Asda would be out of pocket by a huge amount. Their profit margin is 100 times less than the amount of tax.
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robsmith
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Message 108254 - Posted: 26 May 2022, 17:25:16 UTC - in response to Message 108252.  

High street stores pay duty at the time of purchase from their supplier. Duty on alcohol in the UK is levied at production not at the time of sale to the consumer and is calculated following a set of rules which designed to cope with changes in rate, and how those changes are applied along the chain.
Asda, and all other similar stores, will have set their selling price to allow for some percentage of "shrinkage".
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robsmith
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Message 108255 - Posted: 26 May 2022, 17:31:41 UTC - in response to Message 108250.  

Any of the non-human readable text can be perverted to trigger the download or execution of another file - scary or what?
Modern AV software scans these bits for patterns that match, or look similar to, suspicious objects and then acts in an appropriate manner.
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Peter Hucker of the Scottish B...
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Message 108256 - Posted: 26 May 2022, 19:24:42 UTC - in response to Message 108255.  

High street stores pay duty at the time of purchase from their supplier. Duty on alcohol in the UK is levied at production not at the time of sale to the consumer and is calculated following a set of rules which designed to cope with changes in rate, and how those changes are applied along the chain.
Asda, and all other similar stores, will have set their selling price to allow for some percentage of "shrinkage".
Then the government are criminals.

Any of the non-human readable text can be perverted to trigger the download or execution of another file - scary or what?
Modern AV software scans these bits for patterns that match, or look similar to, suspicious objects and then acts in an appropriate manner.
The email program should read those headers as TEXT. It should do nothing based on what is written there. It would be like a policeman saying "what is your name sir?" and instead of giving him your name, you tell him to kill his colleague, so he blindly does so. What you say should be written in his notebook, not acted upon. The email program should not just blindly do what it's told to in a header. Only MS software is that moronic.
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Profile Dave
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Message 108257 - Posted: 26 May 2022, 19:50:21 UTC

Then the government are criminals.


Has that ever been in doubt? (At least since the current lot came to power.)
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Message 108258 - Posted: 26 May 2022, 20:05:56 UTC - in response to Message 108257.  
Last modified: 26 May 2022, 20:06:07 UTC

Then the government are criminals.
Has that ever been in doubt? (At least since the current lot came to power.)
I can't say I noticed when they changed over. I think they just met in the middle and are now both the same.
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Grumpy Swede
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Message 108259 - Posted: 26 May 2022, 20:17:28 UTC

Sigh, endless, endless, endless.....
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Sirius B
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Message 108260 - Posted: 26 May 2022, 21:52:08 UTC

Grumble.
After being screwed over by the system for years...
...still waiting for that £150.
From a post on 2 April
We expect to make the online form available at the end of May 2022.
Now...
We will make the online application form available in mid-June 2022.
Sheesh, 4 months to do a simple update.
Glory.
Now that I'm officially retired, have money thrown at me left right & centre.
Thank you Mr CoE.
Look forward to receiving that £1k+ in Sept/Oct. :-)
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Message 108261 - Posted: 26 May 2022, 21:53:31 UTC - in response to Message 108259.  

Sigh, endless, endless, endless.....


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Profile Gary Charpentier
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Message 108263 - Posted: 27 May 2022, 1:07:34 UTC - in response to Message 108250.  

Why would your email program run code from a header?
Because it is required by the standard. You haven't looked at the standards since the 1.0 versions have you? Delivery of advertising drives the standards now.
I very much doubt there's a standard requiring to run executable code in the headers. This is a set of headers from a random email message I recently received. Show me where code would reside:

What an antiquated mail sender in your example ...
Received: from 10.253.37.223
 by atlas207.aol.mail.gq1.yahoo.com with HTTPS; Thu, 26 May 2022 16:30:45 +0000
Return-Path: <010001810134ab98-455f7521-b524-4cc8-9375-888ef4686341-000000@amazonses.com>
X-Originating-Ip: [23.251.255.195]
Received-SPF: pass (domain of amazonses.com designates 23.251.255.195 as permitted sender)
Authentication-Results: atlas207.aol.mail.gq1.yahoo.com;
 dkim=pass header.i=@recalldageorgegascon.org header.s=ztnarf7htvbalru2erxbqry67trec334;
 dkim=pass header.i=@amazonses.com header.s=6gbrjpgwjskckoa6a5zn6fwqkn67xbtw;
 spf=pass smtp.mailfrom=amazonses.com;
 dmarc=unknown header.from=recalldageorgegascon.org;
X-Apparently-To: xxxxxxxxxxxxxx; Thu, 26 May 2022 16:30:46 +0000
X-YMailAVSC: CSIiH1s3bBtLSXCTw.nY6Iyh.VV0I6jGPY8bFyDE5lcvZam
 o0KySYTXQr2gnVvcjtqoXdqdD0MGWYQ0AahUxqaisIxjkLcWEi2mNa5bBkbB
 1_6ejPd80RhGR9W1aqJEWyqDteM.7cSWsdH7zitvD3_o7lGmOCT9E5tdyVHV
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 uYo1vISnZlMhyk_x7IXbcbr787Hg70WEwBiAHKkk1LLPJjaBUm2hNgWt1UxI
 3
X-YMailISG: 0ryfnsUWLDtZ.VVYHsAEkG_QnsiYCsgIDS75583XgUBZEXgn
 JYbL_ivBVJkHudnbRoKLqSs8drmnUlgsaa.qB3CmHhyLPbX5WOU4vmz8yq48
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 ctZoitMmHwgwhy9LG68dR86s1383yhJlhTPiNsGPy5kkO2BgrdSzx5XCtqo7
 xCGm4g--
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 Thu, 26 May 2022 16:30:45 +0000
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/simple;
	s=ztnarf7htvbalru2erxbqry67trec334; d=recalldageorgegascon.org;
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	h=Date:From:Reply-To:To:Message-ID:Subject:MIME-Version:Content-Type:List-Unsubscribe;
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	zIwPNdPnzg==
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/simple;
	s=6gbrjpgwjskckoa6a5zn6fwqkn67xbtw; d=amazonses.com; t=1653582638;
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Date: Thu, 26 May 2022 16:30:37 +0000
From: =?UTF-8?Q?Recall_DA_George_Gasc=C3=B3n_Committee?=
 <info@recalldageorgegascon.org>
Reply-To: info@recalldageorgegascon.org
To: xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Message-ID: <010001810134ab98-455f7521-b524-4cc8-9375-888ef4686341-000000@email.amazonses.com>
Subject: Remember Hannah Tubbs?
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: multipart/alternative; 
	boundary="----=_Part_2613098_665098026.1653582637962"
X-Campaign-ID: 4329428
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Peter Hucker of the Scottish B...
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Message 108264 - Posted: 27 May 2022, 1:55:27 UTC - in response to Message 108263.  

What an antiquated mail sender in your example ...
What's your point?
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Profile Jord
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Message 108270 - Posted: 27 May 2022, 23:32:16 UTC

Netflix dropped Season 4 of Stranger Things with a lot of horror. Looking through my fingers.
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Message 108272 - Posted: 29 May 2022, 9:19:34 UTC - in response to Message 108260.  

...still waiting for that £150.

Don't want to rub it in, but received mine last month on the 20th.

Glory?
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Message 108276 - Posted: 29 May 2022, 21:35:05 UTC - in response to Message 108272.  

...still waiting for that £150.
Don't want to rub it in, but received mine last month on the 20th.
Mine just got deducted from council tax, so I pay £12.50 less each month for a year.

£400 soon to come deducted from electricity bill! Very important for Boinc users!
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Message boards : The Lounge : Grumbles, Glory, Corona and All Your Off Topic Discussions

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