Posts by marmot

1) Message boards : Questions and problems : BOINC forums login confirmation email never received (Message 111657)
Posted 24 Apr 2023 by Profile marmot
Post:
I could login but, before posting a comment or sending a pm, the forums asked to send me a confirmation letter to the email I've been using since 2006 and it never showed.
Got back on the forms somehow.
My attempts included:
The Skype help desk ended up getting me to one person who was no longer taking part and no other answers.
Left a message in a Google group for BOINC that had D Anderson was a part of.
Asked people I knew in other project forums to ask for help for me here.
Sent D Anderson emails via the Berkley email system.

Not sure how the issue got resolved.
Thankyou to whoever helped.

I still wonder, will this happen again if I do not post to this forum for a year (or some number of months) and will a confirmation message be successfully sent to my email in the future?
2) Message boards : Questions and problems : Which phone. (Message 111656)
Posted 24 Apr 2023 by Profile marmot
Post:
Last phone shopping I settled in on an 2x LG ThinQ 8's used on eBay with slightly cracked screens, one could be hidden by a cover. $45 ea.
6GB RAM. 256GB storage, 8 cores, nice GPU.

Because of water tight seals, all (not seen a easily replicable battery in a phone for the last 4 years) of these phones have batteries that are hard to replace and best to protect the battery above any other consideration.
There is risk here. My Moto G4 battery started bulging and died, BOINC use is at least partially implicated. At least it was a cheap, used phone (with potential battery issues upon purchase?).
An intense Android game can use a full 8 cores and the GPU.
The phone gets hot, but human hands firmly pressed on the case, and blood circulation, are a phone cooling system.
Running BOINC while the phone is alone needs another cooling system if you wish to use all cores.

For simple BOINC use:
Make sure battery saver is at max.
Install a battery temp monitor app. (Simple System Monitor is my choice)
Consider only using 2 main cores of the 8 for BOINC; increase the core count until you break 36C battery temp.
I've read 40C is safe upper limit but after losing the Moto G4 I'd rather keep it cooler. (Can't wait for the new Silicon/Lithium batteries for commercial use)
There are phone cooling pads and you'll need to remove it's protective case at night to maximize cooling and make sure the phone makes a good thermal connection.
3) Message boards : Questions and problems : Too many WUs were downloaded, all settings are ignored (Message 111655)
Posted 24 Apr 2023 by Profile marmot
Post:

Of course a workaround could be to start 3 Boinc instances at the same time, each for one project and there I could limit the threads and remove the app_config.xml. But I was hoping for an easier way.


These issues are at the server side. Many ignore your local preferences. Especially the 0 priority setting.

Save yourself headaches and time.
Setup a different work queue for each offending Project or even a queue for a particular hard to manage WU.
I use a BOINC VM and assign it a current WorkUnit. BOINC FAQs describe how to create multiple BOINC installs for separate data directories.
Either way is a method of virtualizing a queue at the WU or Project level..

I don't mind checking each individual BOINC based VM's BOINC MGR, since they're in the same house.
However many users manage any BOINC port, that advertises itself, from a single BOINCTasks install.
BOINCTasks can communicate with, and manage, all your BOINC VM's/data folders on the your local host and across your network.

I spend a lot of time collecting projects at WUProps.
We have a great amount of experience with any project's quirkiness and managing a wide array of WU's.
4) Message boards : BOINC client : Request: Set Vbox to low piority (Message 102833)
Posted 6 Feb 2021 by Profile marmot
Post:
Is that on an AMD?


It's the used 2700x custom build w/ 16GB I picked up couple months back.

Running 16x Kryptos WU and an SRBase TF on the GPU.

The OS responds a bit sluggish but nothing longer than 1 sec after a click.

The only thing I can't get rid of is Windows 10 MsMPEng.exe Windows Defender process that constantly uses 0.5-2% CPU and 350MB RAM.
None of the methods that are supposed to shut it down, work after the last update from late last year.

Shut down every nonessential service possible and some that are locked out (who needs audio or server shares on a BOINC machine?)

I want to get my hands on the Chinese government version that made MS strip out the store and Defender.
5) Message boards : BOINC client : Request: Set Vbox to low piority (Message 102811)
Posted 5 Feb 2021 by Profile marmot
Post:
Once I finally got Process Hacker to add VBoxHeadless.exe to it's priority adjustment DB; running 16x Kryptos@Home (boot2dockers) VM's seem to be only as sluggish as any other native BOINC app occupying all 16 threads on that Windows 10 machine. (The trick was adjusting the priority of a WU just freshly coming into RAM and then saving into P.H. DB so P.H. could make the adjustment thereafter on each new VBoxHeadless.exe that was seen starting)

It would be nice if lowering the Headless VM's to idle could be accomplished through BOINC management instead of a 3rd party app.
The trick would be getting BOINC manager to adjust to idle only BOINC related headless processes and leave the user's own VM's alone.
TThrottle maintains a DB of BOINC WU's so it can control heat by pausing BOINC related processes for brief moments.
I do not know if it manages VBox WU's, (I vaguely remembering it did tell VM's to reduce CPU usage) but if it does, then those devs might have a possible solution already coded.

Currently all VM's on my machine will now be idle priority, but it's dedicated to BOINC, so not an issue.

(Sorry, about the late reply. Had health issues the last 2 weeks).
6) Message boards : Questions and problems : Slow scheduling (Message 90139)
Posted 15 Feb 2019 by Profile marmot
Post:
If a project wrongly under estimates the duration of tasks then there is little that BOINC can do to stop that stop that project from flooding you with work. If it is consistently happening then you should take it up with the project concerned.



1) Asteroids@home, with a WU name identical for GPU and CPU, has been that way for years and my complaint will be likely ignored. I'll isolate it to a single machine with the GPU it needs or a separate BOINC directory or VM.
2) Rosetta having no server side control for receiving mini or large WU has also been in place for years and I'll say something but have no illusions that it'll get some result.
3) DHEP is ignoring work cache and using the NCI mechanism (from what I gathered) for computationally intensive work. Already many complaints were registered and they stated they are understaffed and won't be addressing it. It's a new project trying to attract massive computational power so, inflated credit and work cache dominance seem to be helpful to that endeavor. Suspending 1 task is best control as the WU's (place holders) are 19 days.

Every other issue on the projects set to 0 resource are minor and likely corrected by yours and Gary Roberts advice.
7) Message boards : Questions and problems : Slow scheduling (Message 90138)
Posted 15 Feb 2019 by Profile marmot
Post:
Here are the details of what these settings do. As an example, assume the first setting was 2.0 days and the second (extra days) setting was 1.5 days. BOINC would regard a 'full' cache would be when the estimates of all tasks add up to > 3.5 days. As you complete and return work, BOINC will not take any action to replenish the cache until the work on hand falls below 2 days. So if you put a value in the extra days setting you create a hysteresis effect between a 'hi water' mark and a 'lo water' mark. For this example those marks are separated by 1.5 days. This is precisely why there would be long periods where no work is being requested.

If a user really wanted the best chance to have a stable level of work on hand, with regular top-ups, I think the best option is to put what is wanted in the first setting and leave the second one at zero. Please realise that BOINC can only make decisions about work fetch based on estimates.


Nice explanation. One for the FAQ's if not already there.


You mention tasks for a single project taking between 5 mins and 10 days. Do these tasks come with proper estimates when you first receive them? No problem if they do, since BOINC can handle that. If they don't, you should complain bitterly in the project's forums since this is really bad behaviour which will cause lots of problems for your client when managing the work flow for multiple projects.


They seem to be proper estimates but my machines are downclocked/upclocked depending on the temperature in the house which is varying daily now that spring is approaching. Unlike Asteroids@home (with a WU name identical for GPU and CPU work which will be isolated from now on), both prime searching projects I've worked for (Primegrid and SRBase) have WU's with short to extremely long computation times (30 minutes to 235 days). One math project, YAFU, has quirky work units that vary in length and give a time-till-completion estimate that is useless. The WU's are multi-threaded and can take from 200,000 to 3,500,000 CPU seconds with unpredictable credit BUT the project owner(Yoyo) understands the issues and only gives out maximum 2 WU per client and gives a second week long deadline past the deadline listed in the client before invalidating.

I'll keep 'additional days' set to 0.
I'll go back to <rec_half_life_days>30</rec_half_life_days> instead of <rec_half_life_days>1</rec_half_life_days> that's been used for the last 3 days since there are several WU that are running 10+ days.

Is it a good heuristic for <rec_half_life_days>X</rec_half_life_days> an X that is twice as long as your maximum WU length?
8) Message boards : Questions and problems : Slow scheduling (Message 90125)
Posted 14 Feb 2019 by Profile marmot
Post:


Assuming you are running projects that take minutes to hours to run then it will have very little impact on scheduling.


The project that is not scheduling frequently enough has WU's that are as short as 5 minutes and as long as 10 days.
So in order to assure that WU's are secured from that project, the scheduler has to be set as if any work is a 5 minute long WU.

The second one is confusingly named "store additional x days", in reality this determines how often you do a call for work from each project, the lower the value the more frequent the check is made to see if you need work, and it can be a very small number (fraction of a day, 0.1 is about 2.4 hour intervals).

Thankyou!

This is where my understanding of the scheduler is flawed. Currently have this set to 1.5 days and that is why the 3 to 12 hour delays.

What is the effect of setting it to 0?
Very frequent updates or does the algorithm assume 0 is to use default value, and what is the default value? (I think default BOINC install was 1.5 days).

Also of course many projects have periods of time when there is no work available for a whole range of reasons, and this can really upset inter-project scheduling, particularly when one considers BOINC works on a medium/long term deficit basis to determine what projects get work and what projects are "ignored".


This is becoming a norm for most my projects as I attempt to get at least 5,000 hours (WUProps) on any project WU that I decide to take on. Much of the time my computers are now waiting to get the infrequent work units.
Also, it seems to my intuition that computing power to BOINC projects has increased over the last decade and that work shortages are more common, but some cross project analysis would need to measure work loads.

I have separate issues on taming the 0 resource share projects that are backups or need to complete their requisite work-hour obligations.

One of two most problematic projects is Asteroid@home. It's set to 0 resource share, yet floods the cache with WU's that are estimated at 110 minutes and then actually take 13 hours. The issue seems to be that the Period Search application is the only application and is both CPU and GPU. cc_config is already set not to use GPU's and there are no usable GPU's in the machine for Asteroids@home so is <rec_half_life_days>X</rec_half_life_days> going to play a part in taming this project? I've given up on Asteroid@home until this is resolved.
9) Message boards : Questions and problems : Slow scheduling (Message 90090)
Posted 13 Feb 2019 by Profile marmot
Post:
Set the value to 0 on 8 machines and the same issues with slow requests from project 3 but eventually the project had a flood of WU's for hours and they got work by the evening.

On the other 16 machines, set 8 to 1 and left the other at 30 days.

The machines set to 1 all got work in the morning.
The machines set to 30 all got work by evening.

Anyone working help desk want to weigh in on what I'm seeing and give me a place to read about the functionality of <rec_half_life_days>X</rec_half_life_days> and a detailed example of how this setting effects scheduling requests?
10) Message boards : Questions and problems : Slow scheduling (Message 90032)
Posted 12 Feb 2019 by Profile marmot
Post:
BOINC version 7.8.3, machine independent, Windows 7.
6 projects, 3@ 0 resource share, 3@ 49 resource share.


If I set <rec_half_life_days>X</rec_half_life_days> to 30 days would that improve scheduling or maybe setting it to the other extreme 1, help?

Would setting it to 0 force the scheduler to request work hourly and ignore the lengths of past work units?

Is there any other mechanism to speed scheduling?
11) Message boards : Questions and problems : Rosetta hogging resources (Message 90031)
Posted 12 Feb 2019 by Profile marmot
Post:
There are many projects that force down work and flood the cache, ignoring their resource share.
Projects servers can't actually 'force down work' - the firewall and NAT (Network Address Translation) in your router would prevent that.

Project servers can only communicate with your computer in the form of a reply to a request made by your computer.


When I said "force down work" I mean they send more work than their 0 or 1 resource share choice would allow, not that they send work without request (you've seen me on here for years... I know better than this).
DHEP (set to 0 resource share), once the high priority projects are out of work and it alone has WU's, fills the cache by sending down 6x ~19 day WU "place holders" so that no other project will see available work cache.


I'd be interested to see the request/reply pair for an event like this - the <sched_op_debug> event log flag is useful for this:

11/02/2019 08:45:02 | SETI@home | Sending scheduler request: To report completed tasks.
11/02/2019 08:45:02 | SETI@home | Reporting 5 completed tasks
11/02/2019 08:45:02 | SETI@home | Requesting new tasks for NVIDIA GPU
11/02/2019 08:45:02 | SETI@home | [sched_op] NVIDIA GPU work request: 7683.10 seconds; 0.00 devices
11/02/2019 08:45:06 | SETI@home | Scheduler request completed: got 8 new tasks
11/02/2019 08:45:06 | SETI@home | [sched_op] estimated total NVIDIA GPU task duration: 7907 seconds
Note that the amounts requested and received are expressed in seconds - duration requested and runtime estimated. They should match.


Will look for an opportunity to catch DHEP with <sched_op_debug> and also interested in Asteroid's results.

The <max_concurrent> tag in app_config was the best answer for the OP's question. If that's not enough (because the project is dominating the work cache) then suspending a single task will lessen project dominance of the cache as they decay off until you manually allow them to grab more work.
12) Message boards : Questions and problems : Slow scheduling (Message 90003)
Posted 11 Feb 2019 by Profile marmot
Post:
Today 29 of my machines missed out a release of work from Project 3 and I need a solution on how to prevent this.

The cores must be occupied 24/7 so there are a few projects set to 0 resource share and the cores are occupied with cache of about 3 - 5 WU of each of those.

Three high priority projects are set to 49 share.
Project 1 checked for WU about every ~3 hours but had no work.
Project 2 checked every ~6 hours and found no work (although the server did give some out to other clients in that period, so missed out on those).
Project 3 asked for work once in ~12 hours, released work in that period, and only my one laptop caught some because it started requesting work frequently in the afternoon (I had suspended all other projects in order to focus on one project that was nearing it's deadline).

The scheduling rate would increase if I left cores idle but it's -10C outside and the machines heat the house.

Project 3 had been working on WU's that are 2 to 7 days long but the WU that appeared today were 1 to 8 hour.

If I set <rec_half_life_days>X</rec_half_life_days> to 30 days would that improve scheduling or maybe setting it to the other extreme 1, help?

Would setting it to 0 force the scheduler to request work hourly and ignore the lengths of past work units?

Is there any other mechanism to speed scheduling?
13) Message boards : Questions and problems : Rosetta hogging resources (Message 90001)
Posted 11 Feb 2019 by Profile marmot
Post:

To find the fraction that each project is using, you add them all up and then divide by each project's resource share.
For example, if you have three projects, all set to 100%, then each project gets 33% of the time (or actually cores).


This doesn't actually work.

There are many projects that force down work and flood the cache, ignoring their resource share.

Even have a seen couple of projects that do this when set to 0 (Asteroids and DHEP, both guilty).

Assigning projects to cores and not a general cache would give more definitive control.
14) Message boards : Questions and problems : Better control of subprojects (Message 90000)
Posted 11 Feb 2019 by Profile marmot
Post:
I would like to see BOINC add an advanced tab with a list of the computer cores with selections to assign affinities of each project to the cores.

This technique could be used to accomplish these goals (and streamline workload management) as, for example, we assign cores 0-3 to 1 project and deny the other projects access while giving cores 3-7 access to all participating projects.
15) Message boards : Questions and problems : Better control of subprojects (Message 89999)
Posted 11 Feb 2019 by Profile marmot
Post:
I would love this kind of local control.

There are many examples over the years (the Cosmology/LHC projects) but one from yesterday is Rosetta@home.

I want to get in at least 5000 hours on WUProps per WU and already achieved that with Rosetta-mini (which are frequent) but not with the full Rosetta WU.

Rosetta doesn't differentiate between the two and has no preferences choice for each WU type.
16) Message boards : Projects : boinc.berkeley.edu/w/ account missing || Malariacontrol,net Wiki page needs updating (Message 80638)
Posted 1 Sep 2017 by Profile marmot
Post:
Further details of my attempts to recover should be handled in PM's with the appropriate wiki manager.
In that case, PM me. To check if you have an account there, I require an email or IP address. If there wasn't an account to begin with, I can make one for you. Please make sure that you're talking about the correct Wiki, we have two.


By looking at the advanced properties of my password manager I found the record creation date and cross referenced to the email account and the confirmation email on that date is for an attempt at a Wikimedia foundation global password across all platforms.

That week there were protests in our city and I never made use of that global account and obviously linked the wrong website in the password manager.
Sorry for the mixup -- correcting the password entry after this post.

What is the procedure to actually open up a Wiki account for BOINC given that the regular procedure is spam-locked?
17) Message boards : Projects : boinc.berkeley.edu/w/ account missing || Malariacontrol,net Wiki page needs updating (Message 80606)
Posted 30 Aug 2017 by Profile marmot
Post:
What happened to my account and how can I get it back?
That depends, what do you think the user name is? It isn't marmot, I checked that already, there is no such name. And seeing that all accounts starting from 2011 onwards are still there, yours -if you had one- must still be there as well. Try different email addresses.


I tried the usual email accts for Wikipedia and BOINC and the two handles in my password manager.
My password manager has an entry for the BOINC Wiki with an account handle and a password and a link to the webpage and I seem to remember making a couple of edits (my memory isn't as reliable as it once was in my 20's).

Further details of my attempts to recover should be handled in PM's with the appropriate wiki manager.
18) Message boards : Projects : boinc.berkeley.edu/w/ account missing || Malariacontrol,net Wiki page needs updating (Message 80605)
Posted 30 Aug 2017 by Profile marmot
Post:
It could be categorized under retired projects, if the category exists, as this Wiki article still shows up from Google search hits when searching for information on the project.?
Whether I set it to a separate page about it being retired or not, that won't matter in this as Google will still be able to find it and all of the other project pages in there. I'll send an email to the PMC to ask them what they want to do with these pages, delete or just easier put a link back into the visible pages and have people add to/adapt these pages.


But if the project is categorized as retired (Like Poem) then a Google hit to the page will show the reader that the project is defunct.
Information on that page would be about a past project and the reader would see this from the category or info on the page.
I'd be against deleting old project pages as history of the BOINC projects should not be lost to future generations, especially historians documenting our efforts.
19) Message boards : Projects : boinc.berkeley.edu/w/ account missing || Malariacontrol,net Wiki page needs updating (Message 80600)
Posted 30 Aug 2017 by Profile marmot
Post:
As an aside, if Malariacontrol.net is no more it seems strange that it is one of the few projects on the recently announced BOINC@TOKYO site !


Have you tried visiting malariacontrol.net?
It's a dead link.
http://downforeveryoneorjustme.com/malariacontrol.net

Archive.org hasn't been able to archive it since October 2016 and I already linked for you above their closing comments on the site about not using BOINC and getting all their needs from private orgs.
Click the link to the archived post.
20) Message boards : Projects : boinc.berkeley.edu/w/ account missing || Malariacontrol,net Wiki page needs updating (Message 80581)
Posted 30 Aug 2017 by Profile marmot
Post:
As far as I know, the BOINC Wikis don't purge accounts based on inactivity. You can't even make an account there, that always has to run via David due to spammers.
We also don't actively link to any projects from the user manual wiki, that's all done via the BOINC front page and the add-project wizard. Those pages may still be there, but if all is well, you cannot get there from a link in the index of https://boinc.berkeley.edu/wiki/User_manual or any of its sub-links.


So this article is then a defunct project page that is no longer linked by the project page:
http://boinc.berkeley.edu/wiki/Malariacontrol.net
It could be categorized under retired projects, if the category exists, as this Wiki article still shows up from Google search hits when searching for information on the project.

What happened to my account and how can I get it back?


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